"if we're going to make mental health accessible, then we also have to be open to the different treatment modalities available"
Q & A with Julia Parzyck of @fitfatandallthat
hey friends!
For this week’s edition of weightless, I spoke to one of the very first people I followed on Instagram who showed me it was OK — and actually helpful — to talk about eating disorder recovery openly. Julia Parzyck is an eating disorder recovery coach and body acceptance Instagram influencer (@fitfatandallthat). She recently launched the Confident Kid Collective, a program to help kids become confident and self-assured teens and adults. In this Q & A, we talk about what eating disorder recovery coaching is, why ‘coaching’ is given a bad wrap, and the toxic positivity that exists social media. Enjoy!!
P.S. The second newsletter for paid subscribers only this month will be sent on Monday morning. If you haven’t already, please consider purchasing a subscription for $5/month or $50/year so I can keep writing essays that make my mom cry and interviewing really cool people!!
"if we're going to make mental health accessible, then we also have to be open to the different treatment modalities available"
JG: Hi! Okay. Walk me through what eating disorder recovery coaching is, for somebody who might not know what it is or has never heard of it before. And how did you get started with it?
JP: Yeah, I think eating disorder recovery coaching is definitely a new type of coaching. Over the last couple of years, it's kind of taken off, which is so awesome. But we work as a collaborative team with registered dietitians, therapists and doctors, to provide a different approach to eating disorder recovery, because it takes a whole team to kind of work through it. If you haven't had an eating disorder — it's a lot, so it takes an entire team and it takes a lot of dedication to your recovery. And as a recovery coach, I provide my clients with a lot of accountability, weekly check-ins, and body image support that some of the therapists or more clinical-type of roles maybe don't address as much. And in the eating disorder coaching space, it’s more than peer support, which you might see in Alcoholic Anonymous or other similar programs. But it’s definitely a pivotal role. There is so much research that recovery coaching has been a supportive add-on to recovery treatment. And it’s a lot more accessible and a lot more affordable [than some other treatment options]. And I know that's why Jayne (Note from Julie: read my interview with Jayne Mattingly of Recovery Love and Care) created her coaching curriculum, to provide more accessible care for those in eating disorder recovery. And I found my way into this space because I struggled with my own eating disorder for 10+ years. I found so much passion and excitement within this eating disorder [recovery] space. And I just loved talking about it. I loved engaging with people about it. And I was like, you know what? I feel like with everything I've learned in my own recovery, my own experience, I would do such a great job at helping those recovering from their own eating disorders. And I met Jayne, who had just created her own recovery coaching curriculum and was like, ‘hey, let me train you.’ And it's been absolutely awesome. Because I had toyed with the idea of going back to school, but it just wasn't for me. Nothing against clinical roles by any means, I just wanted a different role in recovery [treatment]. And coaching seemed to be a really great fit. So that's kind of how I found my way into it.
JG: How do you fit within your clients’ care teams? At least for me, my eating disorder treatment team is comprised of my dietician, therapist and doctor. So how does a coach fit into that team or dynamic?
JP: Right now I'm not currently seeing any clients, so this is speaking from past experiences. And so with the program I had with my clients, I’d see them weekly on a 45-minute Zoom call through a HIPAA-compliant software called Healthie. And I’d meet with them to talk about their goals and typically would work with them for three to six months, but I’m really transparent in that recovery is usually not a three- to six-month period. We're just kind of scratching the surface and creating goals around each client. So I tailor my care for each of my clients. And that's something that's a little bit different with the RLC coaching curriculum, we're aware that all eating disorders don't look the same. And so it's not copy and paste for each client. I work with my clients on body image, working through the way we see our bodies, the way we view our bodies, the way we interact with our bodies. I love working with my clients on joyful movement. That was the big thing that I did with a lot of my clients, which I think a lot of the clinical roles kind of miss just because there's not a lot of education behind it, nor is there enough time to meet all of those areas when it comes to recovery. So I love working on joyful movement with my clients and finding a really healthy relationship with movement. Because that's something I'm really passionate about. I love movement, but I definitely had to figure out a way for it to be healthy for me, so just kind of using my own experience there. And then I also, [help my clients] find a healthy relationship with food. So I’ll talk with the client’s dietician and therapist to see what goals they have for the client, and then make sure I’m piggybacking off of that — whether that's meal support, having meals with my clients, helping with grocery lists, that type of stuff. So mirroring what my clients’ [other providers] are working on, on the back end, and just making sure that my clients are being held accountable and doing those things. So there have been plenty of times where I've had meals with my clients virtually. I've had my clients make sure they're getting their snacks virtually, or, honestly, a lot of the time enjoying a fear food with my clients. And so I've had doughnuts at 6 p.m. on a Monday. So yeah, it's definitely a myriad of different things that I do with my clients. I also really love to incorporate a lot of mindfulness and self care. I'm certified in breath work. So I like to incorporate that with my clients and doing meditations, body scans, that type of stuff. And, again, we don't talk about trauma or anything like that. I leave that to the therapist, but it is something that I'm aware of with the clients so I can be trauma-informed when approaching the client and our sessions.
JG: Yeah. As I was going through recovery early on, that was a missing component on my team. My recovery team was great, but I’d make a meal plan for the week with my dietician and it all sounded fine and wonderful. But I would walk out the door and be like “fuck this” and then not do any of it. And so I think it would be helpful having that extra person there to kind of help cushion you and keep you accountable.
JP: The accountability is the biggest part. I've had multiple clients say, “this is what my dietician told me to do.” And then they’d say, “I don't want to do it.” And so a lot of our session would be like, “Okay, why don't you want to do it? Let's make a plan to meet the goal.” And I’d do a lot of check-ins, I’d tell clients “I need you to send me pictures of the meals,” which a lot of the time, dietitians and therapists don't really have the time to do those types of check-ins with their clients. So, [as coaches], we're kind of picking up those gaps in recovery care.
JG: The thing that really sparked my interest in talking to you for this week’s newsletter was what happened on your Instagram recently. You addressed some misinformation and snarky claims on Reddit that said eating disorder recovery coaching is not real or helpful, and that your work is all a scam. I’m biased because I know it would have been helpful for me, but can you tell me why you think people might be resistant to the idea of ED recovery coaching? Why did you think it was important to address it on your social media?
JP: Yeah, I mean, I get it. Instagram is an interesting space; it’s a newer space. And I think a lot of people have been scorned and wronged by online coaches, don't get me wrong, there are a lot of unethical coaches online, but we can't say that all coaches are bad coaches. Just like we can't say all therapists are good therapists. Just because you have credentials and an education doesn't make you a great person for that job. And, when I read those comments, I was honestly not defensive over the fact that they were talking or slandering about me online, I was more upset because I was like, dang it. This is really good information, this recovery coaching space makes recovery accessible for people. Also, [one of the people] who said that recovery coaching is not an actual job or career, was a social worker. Like that's going to do your clients a disservice if you're not aware of the different modalities that are available for your clients. And I thought it was so annoying because I know that Jayne, myself and all of the other coaches on the team have made an impact and I know the work that I've done with my clients is real and is helpful. I was so defensive and felt like I needed to say something because it's unfortunate that we put out this blanket stereotype when it comes to coaches on social media. And I think that's where you, as someone that might hire a coach, has to do your work in figuring out, is this coach someone that's credible? And is this someone that's going to be ethical? And at the end of the day, I don't know anyone more ethical than Jayne when it comes to virtual coaching and her coaching business.
JG: I feel like Reddit is not always the place where people go when they have nice things to say…
JP: No, it's a snark page. And it's unfortunate, because I think these people have already made up their mind about influencers and what coaches are, and I never set out to have a platform. So it kind of sucks sometimes for people to discredit me as a coach and me as a person and kind of lump me in with this influencer persona of being a scam artist, and that is absolutely not me. And it's unfortunate that now people who have larger platforms [can be] looked at as uncredible because of the following they have. And it's not an intentional thing. I'm not buying followers by any means. But yeah, it was definitely really unfortunate to see because for someone like a social worker, I feel like you are a little uneducated on the different resources available for your clients. We can't keep gatekeeping the mental health space. If we're going to make mental health accessible, then we also have to be open to the different treatment modalities available. I just shared the other day about a school counselor suggesting eighth grade girls wear Spanx, and these are people that are trained to work with you and have credentials. And they suggested a child wear Spanx. So I'm like, just because you have a master’s, doesn't make you a good person to be working with [these issues].
JG: You bring up a good point about how there are some people on social media — and just in the world in general — who call themselves ‘coaches’ and are not actually coaching anybody. And now it can be an empty phrase. When somebody is seeking out an eating disorder recovery coach, what should they look for?
JP: I think first and foremost, the biggest thing is: what type of training do they have?Where did they learn their information from? Also look into whether they are continually educating themselves. Maybe they got their certification or their training a couple years ago, so what have they done in between? Finding someone who's trauma informed is so wildly important, especially because eating disorders usually live within this trauma space. Being a trauma-informed coach is so important especially when navigating such vulnerable clients. And clients should look for a coach who has good boundaries. What I often see with coaches that aren't great or credible, they’ll be like ‘I'm going to be your BFF and we're going to be texting and all this stuff.’ No. We're not your best friend. [There should be] very clear boundaries for what a coach is, and what we provide you with. Once it kind of turns into the friend role, those boundaries start to blur and then the coaching dynamic starts to shift. Also using a HIPAA-compliant type of software and having intake forms are super important, too. Another big thing to look out for is a coach that doesn't pressure you into working with you. Because when you do and it's like, ‘Oh, if you sign up with me today, you get like $1,000 off.’ That right there is just a big red flag that this person is probably coaching you for money, not because they actually want to help you. And because it is such a vulnerable space, pressuring already-vulnerable people into coaching with you, that to me says ‘red flag.’ So having someone that is really going to give you the space to let you mull over your decision is key because I've definitely talked to some business coaches before where I felt that slimy salesman vibe, and I'm like, ‘Ooh, I really don't want to work with you, because you won't stop texting me, emailing me, checking in with me, seeing if I want to work with you.’ The client is going to want to work with you when it's right for them.
JG: That leads me into my next question. Who is a good candidate for coaching? Who would make a good client?
JP: Honestly, it ranges. I've definitely worked with clients that have just gotten out of treatment and are looking for assistance to acclimate back to normal life, like going to the grocery store on their own. So I think those are really good clients, where they're trying to navigate being on their own, grocery shopping on their own, maybe shopping for new clothes, that type of stuff. But I also work with a lot of clients who have a history of yo-yo dieting, and there maybe isn't a need for a treatment center or anything like that, but there's a lot of body image issues or body insecurities or maybe a really unhealthy relationship with fitness. But [an ideal candidate to receive coaching is] someone that's looking for that extra support with the care they're already getting. And this is not to say that I haven't taken on clients that haven't been seeing a therapist, but often times when my clients aren't seeing a therapist, within weeks of starting to see me, they've already started seeing a therapist. Because Jayne and I will help them find a therapist or kind of reassure them their past experiences with a therapist aren't all the same. But [a good client] is someone that's really looking for that accountability. So it ranges; maybe you're struggling with feeling confident in your body, or struggling with your relationship with food, your relationship with your body, your relationship with fitness. I think it also kind of depends on what the coach feels comfortable working with. To go back to your question about finding a credible coach, that is someone who is like, ‘hey, this actually isn't in my scope of care,’ or ‘I feel like I'm actually not a good fit for you and will be referring you to someone else.’ As a coach, you're not going to be a good fit for every single client and that’s okay.
JG: I feel like social media can be kind of a really triggering place for a lot of people. Speaking from my own personal experience, when I was in treatment, one of the first things my therapist made me do was unfollow all of the fitspo Instagram accounts and delete Pinterest off of my phone. And it's actually a real full circle moment right now because you're one of the first accounts I followed who was talking about eating disorder recovery openly. Does being on Instagram, or social media in general, impact your body image?
JP: Yeah, I think in the beginning, more so than now. I love what your therapist suggested, unfollowing accounts that don't make you feel good and following the accounts that do. I feel like my feed is so much of what I do. And it's so many different bodies, so many different skin tones, and literally just so many different types of people that I follow. So when I go on my page, I'm not triggered by the body stuff. I feel like I'm more triggered by this kind of “hustle culture,” of feeling like I’m not doing enough. I feel like, just in general, social media can be super helpful. And you can get a lot of great information from there. You can feel very empowered when you're following the right people. But also, I'm just always aware of how I feel after I get off of it. So for example, after this whole Reddit thing, I deleted my [Instagram] app for this past weekend, and I just reinstalled it today. So I'm like, ‘Okay, I need to be aware of how I feel when I get off of it.’ If I feel like I'm not enough, or I'm not doing enough or I'm not wearing makeup enough, or whatever it is, I usually have to take a break. But I think, honestly, people who say they're never triggered by social media, more power to you, but I feel like it's just kind of inevitable.
JG: Yeah, because it's everywhere. I don't know if you watch Euphoria….
JP: I am going to start that because I keep seeing so many TikToks about it!
JG: It's a really crazy show, but it's good. And there is a really interesting scene in a recent episode where this girl is thinking how much she hates herself. And then all of a sudden she's imagining all these models and Instagram influencers popping up and screaming at her to just love herself. I thought that was a really interesting commentary on the Instagram influencer toxic positivity. And so to come full circle to the recent comments you got about coaching — what you see on social media can be very limited in comparison to what you actually do and your work with clients. What is your perspective on that?
JP: I mean, at the end of the day, I'm not sharing every single second of my life, and I'm not recording my sessions with my clients, because that's such a violation of privacy. So unless you're going to do a discovery call with me and I tell you about what I do and you work with me AND you also see the content that I post, you're not going to actually 100% know what goes into coaching. So for people to cherry pick what they like or don't like based on what they see online, it's not logical. Instagram is only snippets of people's lives and just like the Euphoria scene where you have people saying, ‘love yourself’ and ‘do this.’ It's not that simple. And if it was that simple, then none of us would be feeling any type of way about our bodies or having insecurities. And honestly, I feel like that's why I do have a great following. Because I don't pretend that everything's great all the time. I'm like, ‘yeah, I'm having a bad body day,’ or ‘I'm struggling with this,’ or maybe I'm crying, or sharing about something. Because I mean, that's just realistic. And so you have to realize that what you see on Instagram isn't the full picture. And if you're just cherry picking the things you don't like to create this image of me, that's on you. That’s not on me.
JG: My last big question for you is what would you tell other providers about eating disorder recovery coaching? Especially a provider who might be skeptical or unsure?How would you be helpful to them as providers?
JP: Yeah, absolutely. We do a lot of filling in the gaps of what those providers can do. A lot of my clients and I will talk about their therapy sessions and the fact they don't want to do what their therapist suggested, and coming up with ways we can make sure we do those things to hold ourselves accountable in our recovery. And any coach that is encouraging their client to not seek therapy and not seek working with a dietician or doctor, is just a massive red flag. The right coaches are the ones who want that collaborative care. We're here to support [the client]. And we want what's best for the client. So we're only here to help and to provide more care for the client. We're not here to step on toes. And I think that might be what some of these providers are afraid of. But at the end of the day, it's not about you. It's about the client.
JG: If people are interested in working with you, how should they reach out to you or learn more about you?
JP: I just created a new course called the Confident Kid Collective. I miss working with kids, I used to be a teacher. And through all the work I did with my clients as a recovery coach, I learned it often started very young for them. It started young for me. So I actually want to be more on the preventative end. All of my information is at fitfatandallthat.com or on my Instagram @fitfatandallthat. Shoot me a DM or send me an email. I'd love to chat.